Do Pets Really Need Year‑Round Flea, Tick & Heartworm Meds?

Amy Castro, Host (00:00.268)

If you've ever wondered whether your pets really need those flea tick and heartworm preventatives all year round, this episode is for you. I'm talking with my friend Dr. Linda Atkins about what's really necessary and how to make smart choices for your pets that keep them protected and keep some money in your wallet too.

Amy Castro, Host (00:23.768)

You've reached the Pet Parent Hotline, your lifeline to practical solutions for your toughest pet parenting challenges. I'm your host Amy Castro, and I'm here to help you cut through the noise and turn expert advice into step-by-step strategies so you can stop chasing your tail and start enjoying life with pets again.

Amy Castro, Host (00:47.726)

Before we dive in, I want to tell you about a message I got a couple of years ago from a heartbroken pet parent. They'd reached out because their dog had tested positive for heartworms and they were asking if our rescue could help them cover the $3,000 plus treatment. But before we even got the money together, they found out that the damage was already done and they ended up losing their dog. They told me that they had stopped giving heartworm prevention year round because money was tight and they figured

Okay, if we do it in spring and summer, that should be enough. And I totally get that. But that one decision made with the very best of intentions cost them everything. And I have never forgotten that story or that dog. I think about it every time someone asks, do I really need to give this every single month? So let's talk about it. Linda, thank you for coming back on the show again.

Well, I enjoyed my last visit so much I figured I would come back.

Well, that's good. It's the only time we get to see each other, think, for the most part. Yeah. Well, and you're very popular. I have to say your episodes have been quite well received by my audience.

That's good to hear. I have my clients asking if I'm doing more episodes.

Amy Castro, Host (01:54.467)

there you go. Maybe you need to start your own podcast. I could help you.

I don't know. We'll leave you the podcast today.

Okay, all right. Guesting is a good thing. It saves you all the extra work and you just come in and do your thing and get the glory. So that's okay. So today we're talking about the Wiggly's. The Wiggly's, the creepy crawlies and the things that can cause our pets some chaos and mayhem. And so what I wanted to start off talking about was the fact that even when I was asking chat GPT, my best friend,

to me create a a do's and don'ts. And the first thing it said for the do, do give parasite prevention every single month year round, regardless of the weather. And that's kind of what I wanted to talk about today is, do we really have to do that?

That's it's a good topic and the simple answer is yes Okay, but there's a lot more that goes into that simple answer that we can bend it and shape it and it's so individual So each each pet is so different on that. Yes or no question So the the real answer would be yes but maybe we'll talk about how we can Adjust that depending upon your lifestyle where you live what you have a cat a dog

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (03:16.078)

and what they do.

Yeah. Well, and that's actually a good point. why is it that you think that the real answer is yes? Like, why is it just easier to say yes, do it year round or maybe not even easier? Like, why is that generally the rule?

So if you want to have 100 % coverage, meaning you don't want your pet, your dog, like my dog, for example, I don't want her to get anything, no fleas, no ticks, no roundworms, no hookworms, no heartworms, anything, then you pretty much have to give something every month because there's always a little bit of a risk or a lot of risk depending upon where you live. So it depends upon a little of that. All of the manufacturer's recommendations are for year round.

in order to make sure the pets are 100 % covered. And places like the CDC and the FDA all say 100%, you have to do it year round all the time.

How much of that do you think is liability? Cause I could see to a certain degree, it's like, if I tell you, can skip every other month and then your pet gets something. Now you're going to come after me and hold me responsible, whether it's a vet saying that or the manufacturer or me creating a handout for people. like, do I really want to say you can play fast and loose with the rules?

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (04:30.606)

Absolutely. That's what I always tell my clients. I'm like, well, it's recommended that we give it every month, year round, for 100 % protection. But then we talk. As a local veterinarian, you talk to your clients. They're part of their family. Their pets are their kids. So we say, okay, what does your pet do? Tell me about their day. What do they do every day? Where do they go? Where do you live? Do you live in New York like me or do you live in Texas like you?

So it's so variable, the location in the country, what kind of pets you have, what kind of cat, is it a cat, is it a dog? And then what do you want to protect them from? Do you want to protect them from everything? Or do you want to just protect them from the things that are really, really bad?

Yeah. So there's a fine line I think between like I, I mentioned before we came on the air, I play a little fast and loose with the rules and part of it is running a rescue and having as many pets, just even my personal pets. It starts to, when we're going to talk about money in a little bit, but it really starts to add up if you follow it rigidly by the rules. So then I start playing this game in my head. You know, it's like my cats are indoor cats. They don't go outside. The only thing they get exposed to.

Right now, in the past, it's been different. But right now, the only thing they're getting exposed to is my dogs who do go outside on the lawn in the broad daylight. And, you know, they're in and out, in and out. So if my dogs were coming up with fleas a lot, I probably would do more. But since I've not had a problem, I kind of make, I won't even tell you what my rules are because you probably would cringe, but I kind of make my own rules a little bit.

You almost have to be an actuary because you have to assess those risks. And what is your risk? know, in Texas, your risk of your dog getting heartworm is much higher than my dog in New York, just because, you know, heartworm is very seasonal. It's spread by mosquitoes. But in the spring, my yard was inundated with mosquitoes. There were so many mosquitoes. So I had to make sure, okay, my dog is on a preventative for heartworm that's spread by mosquitoes.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (06:38.222)

So then my risk was much higher, maybe even than yours at that time of the year. So it's all about assessing like what they're doing, where they're going, and what do want to protect them from.

Yeah, that's a good point. Yeah. And I will say very clearly, I don't mess around. The heartworm medicine is given religiously because my first little dog buddy, not my first little dog, my first little, what should have been a rescue. And I thought, I'm just going to pick up this dog and then I'm going to turn it into a rescue. And then it's like, well, he really needs grooming. So I'm going to take him to the groomer, but then the groomer wouldn't take him without vaccines. So I took him to the vet and I got him vaccines.

And then they said, well, do you want to do a heartworm test? And I thought, well, that would be a good thing if we know that he's heartworm negative for the rescue. And of course he was heartworm positive. So I did pay the expense for that and it was very expensive. And of course, obviously dangerous to the dog, but you know, there's that and then there's my dog has some fleas and is itchy, you know, like, so what is the risk, I guess, you know, let's talk about fleas first.

The risk fleas like a certain environment to grow in. They have to have a certain amount of humidity. So it has to be high humidity and high heat or else they're not going to multiply. So if you're in a very dry area, it's 100 % sun, it's going to dry up those fleas. You don't have to worry about them as much. But if it's hot, it's humid, you have bushes, you have shrubs, you have squirrels. Squirrels have lots and lots of fleas. So you really have to watch those. You have stray cats.

You have animals around you that are not protected from the fleas. So the fleas have a place to multiply. So even though your dog is not really outside all that much and is kind of protected, if they're going out and you have a lot of stray cats, then, you know, your flea potential goes up much higher. You're moving into a new apartment and you don't know if it's been exterminated. You know, I'm putting something on my cat if it's going into a new apartment, because you don't know what's been in there.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (08:42.818)

you know, have they been doing flea control? it's really about, know, fleas are pretty easy to prevent. They're a little harder to get rid of. So once you have them and you always have to treat everybody in the house, you can't just treat one dog. If you get fleas in your house, you have to treat all six cats, all five dogs, not just the one that has the fleas. So it gets a little crazy with that.

Yeah. So you might be thinking you're saving money by not treating. Then you end up spending a lot of money because now you've got to treat everybody. You got to treat your house. remember, it's funny you bring that up because I remember, so for those who have not listened to other episodes with Linda and I, we were friends before we worked together at the vet, but she, she is actually a vet at the vet we worked at in high school and she kept on and actually was smart enough to go to vet school. I, on the other hand was not.

But I remember Dr. Petro, when somebody would come in and their animal would have fleas and bomb in the house and treating this and treating all the bedding and all the washing. it's like, my gosh, you get like set off a nuclear bomb in the house. it's not easy to get rid of them if you get a good infestation or it can be really difficult to

little easier now because we have so many new products and I know you're going to talk about that, but it's some of those new products and all the different options we have for treating fleas and ticks that make it very confusing for people to kind of decide what to do. But you know fleas aren't your deadly parasites, so they're not, they're concerning, but yes you can get tapeworms from fleas, you can get other different parasites from fleas, but they're, I don't feel as though they're as...

concerning as around me in New York are the tics. A of tics and they carry tons of diseases, Lyme disease, anaplasma or lichia, Rocky Mountain spotted fever. They're all in the tics around here. So we have to be extra cautious more so about the tics than the actual fleets.

Amy Castro, Host (10:42.028)

Well, and that's something that we don't know. Obviously we have fleas. Excuse me. We have ticks in Texas, but I can tell you with all the animals that we have had come through, you know, probably 5,000 animals I've interacted with in my volunteering and rescue and everything else. I've never seen a tick on one of them. The only thing I've ever seen a tick on was my husband. And that was, he didn't get it here. It was when he was out in the woods at his deer lease and he would come back and there'd always be like a, you know, a tick kind of working his way in his.

tucked in pant leg or something like that. But all those things that you mentioned, how many of those things impact people too? Like know Lyme disease, I mean, that can be devastating for somebody to get Lyme disease.

most of them are zoonotic, meaning they can go to people and to pets. Fleas, not as much, although we have to all remember bubonic plague and the Black Death is spread by fleas, so we have to keep that in mind. We don't really see that anymore, but you can. But all of the tick disease, as I mentioned, go to people as well. So you don't want the ticks coming in and then being on the dog and then on you, but

Like you said, you don't see any ticks, whereas the other day I took almost 100 ticks off a dog's leg. What? tons, we have so many, but your environment.

I don't know. mean, they may be out there, but I always think about ticks as being things in the woods or in taller grass and things like that. The places where my dogs go out here, it's lawn. And when I think about where people live in Houston, even people that have land, it's usually cleared for cattle and things like that. And so their pet pets are going out on a lawn or in a subdivision or something like that. So yeah, I'm sure there probably are places that have them. just personally...

Amy Castro, Host (12:25.006)

Like I think if I saw one on my dog, then it would be a whole different ball game because then now I know they're there and, but we've just never had an issue with them, but it's definitely something to be aware of. how would you even find out? Like if you move to a new area, like I'm looking at possibly moving to Connecticut and I already know the ticks are going to be an issue. Just ask the local veterinarian what, what parasites you to be worried about.

know your area better and then they do a risk assessment. Where is your dog going to be going? Is it a tiny white dog that's only going to be in your apartment and use a wee-wee pad so their exposure to fleas and ticks is much, much less than you have a lab and you're going to take it hiking, you're going to go on the Appalachian Trail, you're going to go in the woods every weekend, then that dog's exposure is much higher. You have an invisible fence so there's deer in your backyard.

foxes in your backyard. There's, you know, everything out there that they can actually get exposed to. So it's really, maybe they're out all day, all day long. So then they need some kind of protection for those topical, I call them all topical parasites versus internal parasites. makes it...

We're focusing on the topical ones today.

Yeah. Versus the internal ones like heartworm and roundworms and all those totally different conversations sometimes.

Amy Castro, Host (13:46.508)

Yeah. And then heartworm, you know, that's like I said, it's something that I don't mess with because here in Texas, it doesn't matter what time of year there are going to be mosquitoes. I don't remember which veterinarian of mine said it, but what she said was it's not a matter of if your animal, if your dog or cat is going to be infected with heartworm, it's just a matter of when because it's happening.

And so I kind of had this image in my head that every single month my dog is being, or my cat is being bitten by mosquitoes that have heartworms. So therefore there is no messing around because we can see him at Christmas time.

yeah, that's how high the incidence is, especially in the South. Heartworm is, if your dog is not on preventative for a month and it's outside in the South, it's definitely getting heartworm. It's being exposed to heartworm is getting heartworm. And those mosquitoes are very efficient. It only takes one bite for you to get the dog to have the heartworm. So it's something you really have to be cautious with. Whereas up in New York, it's, they say the...

positive rate is one in a hundred dogs are going to be testing positive from the labs that do the tests, but that's only the dogs that are tested. Whereas not everybody brings their dog to get tested. So it's probably much higher incidence than that. And as it gets warmer up here, everything is getting warmer. There's more exposure because the mosquito season is longer. And we, like you said, you can have a mosquito at Christmas. I definitely could have a mosquito in November, even though I'm in New York.

Yeah. And we did a whole episode on heartworms and why preventatives are so important and the cost of heartworm. But it's not something that humans can get, but heartworm for dogs and cats. it's the cost of treatment is a huge thing. People don't realize they don't want to spend that $10 or even, you know, up to 50 bucks a month on something that's going to prevent it. But down here, you're looking at $1,500 minimum for treating a dog for heartworm and then the physical impact.

Amy Castro, Host (15:49.486)

What does it do to your dog?

Yeah, the treatment is definitely worse than the preventative. So the drugs that are needed to kill the adult heartworms are much more rough on the dog system than the ones that are needed to kill the larvae of the heartworm, which is what you're doing every month with your preventative. You're pretty much treating after your dog gets it. That's the thing about heartworm. You're not preventing the heartworm. You're preventing the tiny baby heartworms from becoming adult heartworms.

Adult heartworms are really hard to treat and you need much stronger chemicals versus the baby heartworms, which are easier to treat with a monthly preventative. Whereas your cats, like if I lived in a very tropical area where there are a lot of mosquitoes, I'd probably have my cat on heartworm preventative because the cats can get it too and they don't get the same type of disease as the dogs do and we don't

them as much for it, but they can get some really severe conditions with their lungs associated with those heartworms, because they live for two or three years in the lung before they die, and that's where they're causing all that trouble.

And there isn't a treatment for cats. Like if a cat tests positive for heartworm, there's nothing, there's not a treatment like there is for dogs, there?

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (17:03.278)

there's not, no, there's not a good treatment. They can go in with a scope and take them out of the heart through a blood vessel, but that's really more high tech than most places have. So yeah, if you have up here, the cats aren't on as much heartworm preventative, but I do have outside cats that are on it because so many of the products that are available now cover lots of different parasites. And that's what makes it.

somewhat confusing for your guests and definitely for my clients because there's just so many different options for treatment. What am I treating? How am I treating it? What preventative do I actually need?

Yeah. I was just thinking about all the people that I have come in contact with through the rescue that, you know, cause that's one of the things that we talk about when we're screening applications is we do check and see when was the last time your existing pets were at the vet and are they on heartworm preventative or they should, we shouldn't even be calling it preventative, right? Prevented it from preventing it from advancing. But, it's amazing to me, the people that don't realize that they need to be on it and, and

many times for at least the conversations that I've had, it's people that have moved from other places. Like I was living in Maine and now I live in Houston and I didn't realize how bad the problem was. And I don't know, we need to, we need to somehow do a better job of letting people know how big of an issue it really is.

We have a lot of snowbirds in my practice. So they start out in New York and then they go down south for the winter time. And I always remind them, it's like, you might be skipping with your small white dog up here in the summertime, but when you get down to Florida, you cannot skip your preventative because they will get it.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (18:49.1)

big, although we don't have as much heartworm, we have a lot of influx of those rescue dogs. People are adopting. We'll see them. got their dog from the South. They got it from Louisiana and we test them and then we test them again six months later to make sure that they're negative.

Yeah, so why the retesting? Because we had a situation like that here. Of course, it was a great Pyrenees, so it couldn't be any bigger to have to try to treat because the cost of the treatment for dogs is proportionate to the size of the animal, at least it is down here. And we had tested the dog when the dog came in and she was negative and we put her on heartworm preventative. And I don't remember how long after it was that the...

that the owner, the new owner took her in and she was positive. And we ended up paying, you know, cause we, felt bad about it. It's like we tested her, we told them she was negative and then she pops up positive and they had been, I trusted them that they were religious and giving the medication every month. So how does that happen?

So most of the tests that the vets are doing, we're testing for adult worms. We're not checking for the larva. Now maybe in the South, a little different, but most of the time you're testing for the adult. So if you test the dog and it has the larvae, you don't know. then that larvae, now you put it on preventative, so you've killed the rest of them, but one of them, a couple of them got through and is now forms an adult heartworm. And now that adult heartworm, you'll detect as it grows,

in that six month later, now you picked up that adult heartworm that's there in the heart and the adult ones are the ones that cause all the damage.

Amy Castro, Host (20:27.214)

So that's probably good advice for people who get a new pet to test again in six months, just to be sure that they were, know, cause you don't know what the history, especially if you don't know what the history was prior to you getting that pet. Cause we go in, we pop them with everything and then it's like, now it's on you. You know, we don't know what's going to happen down the road.

in a high risk area, definitely testing them twice.

Yeah. So it sounds like, you know, that, you know, and I know that the preventative then I was looking this up right before we got on online or online to have this conversation here. You know, it can be depending on the medicine, depending on what it is, whether it's flea or heartworm, but you know, it could be 10 bucks a month. The injectable, the pro hearts and things like that are, you know, 50, $150 a pop. It doesn't seem horribly expensive, but that seems to be the excuse that people have for not

doing it is that, it's so expensive. Do you get pushback on that from people when you

Oh, yes, especially if they have multiple dogs. So if you just want to protect against heartworm, you may spend with the generic $5, $7 a month. So there are ones that if it's just heartworm you're worried about, there's those. If it's flea and tick, then it might be $12, $15 a month. So if you combine them, because a lot of the medications now are for convenience, because we all like to have things that are convenient.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (21:53.614)

I personally like to give my dog one thing a month, so I don't forget to give it. And a lot of the new prescription oral ones, medications, know, like the simpericas, the brovectos, the Nexguards, they're all oral preventatives and they control against all the parasites. So it's roundworms, it's all the things on the outside and on the inside, I tell clients, because then you're protecting them against everything, but you'll probably spend $30 a month.

If you really need extra protection because you want to get all the parasites, you could do like $38 a month and that's a lot per dog. I try and make sure I know what their risks are and what is it about convenience because you can get less convenience stuff that's not oral, that's much cheaper.

What about, what about people that are concerned about, like I have gotten, and it's maybe because I've, I've interviewed so many holistic veterinarians on the show. And it's like, maybe I've gone a little to the left on some things like vaccinations and things like that. but I do even for myself, like when I go out to mow the lawn, I used to wear my bee suit. Last year, the mosquitoes were so bad here. I would put on a full blown, the white Michelin man bee suit.

to mow because I would just be eaten alive by mosquitoes. But I hated spraying, not only because it's greasy and disgusting, the, you know, the bug spray, but then thinking about that stuff just soaking into my bloodstream, I don't know, it just was, it kind of freaked me out a little bit. And there's a lot of people who don't want their pets ingesting all those chemicals or having it on their body. Or are there alternatives to the chemical versions?

Yeah, pretty much everything that you're using to kill these parasites, they're a chemical. So the ones we used to use, the topical products that we used for fleas and ticks years ago, like when I started practice, those were much more toxic than any of the stuff we use now. But it is a monthly chemical that you're giving. So you have to kind of risk how much risk is there for my dog getting these parasites that are going to make it sick versus this small monthly dose of a chemical.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (24:06.798)

You really can't get around that. The ones that are the ones from the veterinarians are, they're generally very safe. I don't have a problem giving to my own dog. tell people the holistic ones are not always 100 % effective. That's the problem. So you may be spending the same amount of money for the holistic ones, but how protective are there? So depending upon your risk, depending upon your area.

they might be perfect for you, but you may have to use a variety of different products to get the same coverage for the outside and the inside.

Yeah, you had mentioned, you gave me an example of somebody that didn't want to, and you don't have to name the person or go into any great detail, but it was quite the routine that this lady was willing to go through to treat her pets to not do the chemicals.

Yeah, because I give my dog one pill per month and it covers pretty much everything. It probably runs your average person about $35 a month, which it's a dollar a day. It's, you know, a couple of cups of coffee that maybe you have to do without.

Yeah, that's the thing. People complain about the expensive things and when you really add it up, you probably got 10 times that amount in Starbucks this month or takeout. Yeah, give up the dog treats and get the pill instead.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (25:24.642)

Yeah, our doctor.

And those dog treats have a lot of calories. So if people are concerned about the cost, say, well, what do you spend on dog treats? And they're like, oh, like $12 a bag, maybe, you know, twice a month, maybe three times a month. I was like, well, if you gave green beans or carrots, those are a lot cheaper or berries, natural, you don't need the treats and then you can use the preventative. But yeah, in order to have good coverage, there are a lot of holistic medications on the, on the market. They're probably going to cost you as much as your monthly one pill for everything.

So it's not going to be cheaper. But if you don't want to use chemicals, there's ones that are sprays and powders, supplements like garlic and yeast that you give your dog every day. So she has five dogs, and she makes sure they get baths, they get supplements, they get topical non-insecticide sprays that have cedar and pine in them. She combs them all every day to make sure she doesn't see any.

Everyday people

Every day and she's really vigilant about when they're outside. You know, if you're not outside from dusk to dawn, then your mosquito exposure is less. And she tests twice a year. So she tests for all the tick diseases, the heartworm twice a year to make sure she's not missing. You're not missing an infection that could make the pet really sick because you're checking.

Amy Castro, Host (26:51.138)

Yeah. In the end, it's going to come down, think a lot. Well, and you said it, it's going to come down to your tolerance for risk. Like how much am I willing to risk the chance that my pet could get this? And I'll be honest, like with the, you know, the flea medicines for our pets, we probably give it every other month, maybe just to kind of like stay ahead of a power curve. But you know, my dogs, they go in, they go out to the grass. I half the time they don't even like to go to the grass.

And then they come right back in the house. They're not hanging out outdoors. And it's usually in the blazing part of the day. I don't have trees and a lot of bushes in my backyard. And so I've kind of gotten away with that. And that for me has been a way to save money. I'm not advocating that to anybody because I don't want you getting your house infested with fleas and then sending me a bill for your exterminator or something like that. But the risk versus the cost, I think, is a juggling act for people.

I guess I don't worry about the chemicals as much maybe as some. haven't, you I give them to my own dog. know they've used, there's millions of doses that are used and the side effects are very, very low. But they're side effects to pretty much everything we might use.

Yeah. Well, then there's always that, and I know I've seen it fairly recently and I won't name the drug. And of course that one person's pet got violently ill and had seizures. And I don't remember what the outcome was. People will see that one example and then they'll put it out there on this, on social media. And suddenly everybody's freaking out about giving their pet that medication.

Your risk is very, very low, whereas the risks of dogs getting heartworm is much higher. know, if it's one in 20 dogs are testing positive, and like you said, if your dog is in a month without preventative, it's getting heartworm. So that is a much higher incidence to me. And then you have to worry about if you have, we didn't talk about internal parasites, but if you have kids at home or you have someone that's immunocompromised and you can't risk them getting...

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (28:55.63)

these parasites, then you have to be a little more vigilant because you're protecting your family, you're protecting the children in the house. So I always ask about that, whether there's kids at home, is there anybody that's on immunosuppressive? We got to be more cautious. And clients will usually bring that to your attention that they never ever want to see a flea, a tick, or a worm. And then I'll say, well, then you have to have better coverage. if they don't mind maybe testing, then we just test them more frequently.

Yeah. Yeah. And that's a conversation. You know, I think sometimes people, it's funny you say that because I think down here, people are maybe, maybe less likely to be like, look, man, I don't want to see any of this stuff on my pet. It's, you know, it's the vet told me I had to, and now I'm looking for another vet because they're just trying to grab my money. mean, that's, that's kind of the passive, the passive way of handling things. And, you know, I think people need to

do a better job of just have that conversation with your vet. Your vet is gonna promote the gold standard, right? I mean, you're gonna say this is what you should do unless you tell me otherwise, that your lifestyle is different, your pet is different, you have different plans. Like you didn't tell me you were gonna go and live in the Adirondacks for three months. And my advice would have been different had I known that from Manhattan or something like that, right?

that definitely makes a difference. And then asking them what, you know, what are they looking for? they looking for convenience in a product? Are they looking for something that's easy to apply? Do they want to just use a collar or they don't want their dog wearing a collar because their three year old like gnaws on the dog. So they don't want to be gnawed.

I didn't even thought about that. That's bad.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (30:36.108)

So collars are safe or their other dog chews the collar and some of the collars are toxic if somebody ingests it, a dog ingests it. It's very confusing, like the market for the preventatives. And if you don't know what you're looking for, there's so many products out there and then you're choosing the wrong product or the right product. It's very confusing. Yeah. And there's new ones every day.

Yeah, so you really, so you need to do your homework and you need to partner with your vet and have the conversation about what you're trying to accomplish. How do you live? How does your pet live? And then ask for your options. You know, that's the other thing is,

Don't be afraid to ask. Yeah, don't be afraid to ask. be, like, I don't judge people because they're not on heartburn preventative. You know, I tell them what I'd recommend. This is what I do for my dog. But just because you don't want to do some, like, just like vaccines. If they don't want to give them, I tell them why I give them and why I recommend them. But I'm not going to not see you as a patient because you're not doing what I recommend. At least, you know, that's how our practice works.

You know, you can have our opinion and you can either follow it or you can have your own.

Or you can pay the price. I'm just kidding. Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, in the end, it's your, it's your judgment call as a, as a pet parent, but, but it's also then your responsibility if you don't follow the advice, the, of the person that's knowledgeable as well. So we're all grownups. need to make these decisions for ourselves.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (32:06.254)

When your dog gets mange, because we recommend it, like around here, like maybe not as much in Texas, but we have a big problem with mange actually, because of the fox population. In the suburbs, everybody's got foxes now in their backyard and pretty much every fox in the county I live in has mange. So if your dog is in your yard and rubs up against that nice fox smell, they're going to get mange.

if you don't have them on a preventative, they can get it. And I've had clients who'll be like, I don't worry about that. My dog's not going to get mange. And sure enough, that was the one that had seven dogs, all pretty much indoor little fluffy dogs, small, all less than 20 pounds, came in with one itchy dog. And she's like, it's really itchy. I'm like, looking at them like, How's mange? How do we get mange? I was like, well, do you have foxes?

you

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (33:00.28)

There's a den of foxes in my neighbor's yard now. I was like, well, that's where they got it. Easy to treat now with the new products, but yeah, they can get it.

Yeah, when I got my dog Gunny, the bulldog, was, she and her sister came into animal control and they were, they were riddled with, I wish I had better pictures because the pictures that I have are blurry because she was so, she was so wiggly, but she was just covered in mange. Okay. And I've had this dog for now nine years and I don't give her the medication. Like in the beginning, I gave her this medication to get rid of it. And then we gave it every month for several years. And then we kind of cut it back to period, you know, periodic, but.

Even nine years later, like the other day, and I don't, you have to tell me if I'm wrong, maybe this is not mange, but there are certain little crusty, scungy spots that pop up again. And then I give her the medication again for a month or two and it goes away. Like, is that mange again or is that just coincidence? I don't know.

Maybe it could be either one, could be either one. But now this client, she's like, I'm never stopping this medication because I don't want to because that's another one. you can get it.

Yeah. Nice. Just what I need. What's that on your face? just a little bit of mange. Sorry. All right. So let's, let's, before we wrap, I do want to talk about money here. I know we've talked about it a little bit, but any other things that you want to tell people or, know, what do you wish they knew more about when it comes to these, these issues?

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (34:29.23)

I think if you have questions, definitely ask your local vet because they're going to know your local environment. Because what I tell you where I am is different than maybe where you live in Kentucky, where there's more intestinal parasites or you have kids and you want to prevent against this. So definitely ask someone. There's a couple of really good sites that are, they're veterinary sites, but they're really easy to navigate for the public. And I get pretty much all my information from the American.

Parasite Companion Animal Parasite Council. So it's called CAPC. So it's the Companion Animal Parasite Council. They have maps. They have numbers. They have all the parasites. They have all the preventatives listed. And it helps you kind of make a decision and it gives you all the information you could ever want. It's very easy to navigate the site. Or the American Heartworm Council is a good place to go. Just so you have the correct information because you try to get information off the internet.

You know, it could be.

Facebook don't be asking in that mom's group. Do we have text here?

Yeah, it's because you want to make sure you

Amy Castro, Host (35:35.246)

Don't ask them.

the right information. And there's beautiful maps. I looked at it the other day. was like, this is great. You just click on your state. tells you how many cases of heartworm they've seen in your state. You can even get it down to county if you really wanted to know. Or how many cases of Giardia have they seen in Pennsylvania this year? And that's something that lists just the ones that are tested. So there's a lot more that aren't tested.

just getting the right information without asking. If you have a health problem with your kidneys and you're going to ask your hairstylist, maybe you should ask your doctor. people ask their groomer. And I love groomers and they do a great job and it's a really hard job to do. But they're constantly asking the groomer for advice, which is tricky.

Yeah. Well, it's like I said, there's like the people that put the stuff out on, it's appalling to me sometimes. It's like the things that people will put out on Facebook or they'll reach out to me because I run a rescue and it's like, they'll send me a picture of something and be like, do you think I should go to the vet? I'm like, I think you should go to the emergency vet right now. You know, it's like, don't ask me. I'm an idiot. You know, I'm not a veterinarian. Yeah. Um, that actually made me think about when you were talking about the, these

websites and we'll put the links in the show notes, but we have international listeners as well. My assumption would be, and I'll do some homework after this recording, that there are hopefully other resources for other countries or other parts of the world.

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (37:17.432)

yeah, because you may have totally different diseases than we have here that we just never see. So you definitely have to know what your diseases are in your area and how am I going to best protect my pet from them.

Definitely. All right, so let's talk about saving some money. So you already answered one of my questions. So the home remedy type things or the holistic stuff is not necessarily saving you money. it's also, to me, time is money. So if I have to spend a lot of time doing something, I'd rather spend the money.

You're not going to save money doing it holistically the right way. So if it's not about the money, then absolutely that's an avenue you can pursue or you can research and see what the protection that's claimed by each of the products. As a veterinarian, we always have products on our shelf to sell people who don't want to go through the internet. So they're there, we have them. They probably cost a little bit more because we have to stock.

them. We don't stock everything though. And now there are so many products that we have a few, but the rest you can get through something like our online pharmacy. our online pharmacy is very competitive with places like Chewy and PetMed and some of the bigger companies. So that's where I steer people. If they want a product that I don't have or they want to save a little money, they can go through our online site. Most veterinarians have that, that it links right through their website.

But the companies have coupons too, manufacturers coupons. It's cheaper to buy in bulk, just like everything. You're going to buy 12 doses versus one dose. It's going to be a little cheaper. But choosing the right product that fits your pet the best and not overspending on something you don't need. If your dog never leaves the house, it's probably not going to get things like tapeworms and whipworms as much. So maybe you don't need one of the products that has a plus next to it or

Dr. Linda Atkins, DVM (39:15.724)

or covers everything. So you can save a little bit there.

Yeah. And what about as far as, well, one of the things that I was going to mention too, is the idea that annual or semi-annual trip to the vet to renew some of these medications. So let's just talk about your annual, because that's another episode I've got coming up, is that it shouldn't be a shock that that's coming up. And so to say suddenly now I can't afford it when it comes around, it's like you've known for a year. So we, you know, we probably all need to do a better job of budgeting for that.

so that, you know, if you know it's going to cost you 10 bucks a month, like my philosophy is always get a ballpark price of what you think it's going to cost you, add 20 % to be safe, and then just, you know, save that along the way. Put it aside, put it in an envelope in your nightstand, wherever you want to put it, but save that aside so that when you get to that 12, because, you know, putting that dollar amount divided by 12 and doing it once a month is going to be a lot less painful than that.

$900 credit card swipe or whatever it might be when you bring your three cats in or something like that. you know, saving for it in advance, it's, you know, it's not a shock when it comes around. Yeah, and I remember back in the day, and I think it was HeartGuard that had that had really good rebates on things like if you bought six months worth or you bought 12 months that either way, it's still more cost effective to buy in bulk, right?

Yeah, most of the companies have those. If you buy 12, then you're going to get a discount with that. And you might not have to, you might want to coordinate with your vet. You have your vet visit, your annual visit that's going to cost X amount of dollars. Maybe you don't buy your 12 month of preventative at the same time. You split it up, you buy one month and then you can buy six months. So then you buy six months. So you can definitely break it up and watch for sales.

Amy Castro, Host (41:08.27)

What about people who say, I've got a whatever, St. Bernard and I've got a Chihuahua, because I happen to have a 55 pound bulldog and a four pound Chihuahua. Can't I just buy the big dog pills and give my Chihuahua like the proportionate percentage of the heartworm pill or the flea medicine or whatever it is, or is that just a no-no as a way to save money? Because I know people do it.

I would say that's a no-no because you don't know how that medication is distributed in that pill. You like to assume that it's distributed within that little beef chew all over the whole thing, but not always. It may only be in a corner of it. So if you're eating the whole thing, you're protected. But if you're eating just the corner, you may have a higher dose or you may have a very low dose. So I wouldn't recommend doing that.

Good point. All right, well, Linda, this has been a very buggy conversation. I appreciate talking to you about it.

Always happy to help.

I appreciate it. If this episode helped you feel a little more confident about protecting your pets without wasting money, please make sure to follow the show so you never miss a conversation that cuts through all the noise that's out there. And if you know someone who's stressing out about whether to skip this month's send them this episode. They're going to thank you later. Still wondering if your pet really needs year round protection or if you have a story about what happened when you skipped it, I'd love to hear about it.

Amy Castro, Host (42:34.314)

Email me using the link in the show notes or tag me on social. Your question could be featured in a future episode. Thanks again to Dr. Linda Atkins for joining me today and to you for tuning in. I know you've got a lot on your plate and I'm so glad you chose to spend part of your day with us here. Let's keep making pet care easier together. And remember, your pet's best life starts with you living yours. So be sure to take good care of yourself this week and your pet.